Tulpa.info - tulpa-discussion

IRL? (edited)

Yes

7:20 PM

It makes me uncomfortable bc i dont like making ppl feel stupid

7:20 PM

I have trouble being either too nice or too mean abt shit like that

Just a friendly reminder this is #tulpa-discussion

berockly (TTG)

Im next to people who dont know the basic math we are doing

Don't look at me

Yea i was making a quick statement

1

Deleted User

which you would greatly benefit from having

Excuse me I will have you know that my scepticism is so powerful and so wise that I can simultaneously seriously consider telekinetic poltergeist servitors, and reductive materialism. ಠ_ಠ (plz interpret the exact intended connotation precisely correctly or infer a suitable-for-my-purposes connotation because my message might easily seem rude otherwise) (edited)

8:44 PM

ree

1

Well said! (edited)

wut

I just like how you ended it with ree

me too

I was troubling myself over my message possibly being seen as ruuuuuuude.

it was more reede

https://discord.com/channels/431579755037589505/821731704112152576/892515817600745502 Also maybe I am actually sceptical and a practitioner of empiricism, I just sometimes don't match and avoid certain patterns. Yeah that's right, you have not proven that I am lacking in either of those ways, oh dear my scepticism of the idea that I lack scepticism makes me suspect (sceptically from lack of empiricism to back it up), that thou hast made a conclusion despite lack of empiricism oh dear. You can thank me later.

1

hm? i said you would benefit from introducing scepticism and empirism to your every day life, just like everyone else

9:41 PM

you don't need to be so defensive

What on earth is happening.

I don't know but 'thou hast' was used in a sentence and thus I am impressed.

1

sounds like remstein's song

Rammstein*

This feels like the conversational equivalent of trying to pluck out one loose thread and it completely unravels the whole thing.

The Bayeux Tapestry (which is all about events around the Norman conquest of England) was actually made with a single thread, and in theory if you were to pull it out the battle of Hastings would play in reverse order. Thanks for reading my fake fact, and goodnight.

2

Lol

I hereby exit this conversation <_<

FInally!

D:

If I have a new tulpa, can I introduce him here?

You can also introduce him in #lounge , you can let him talk to us :p

He's up for that

Hey people not really sure if this would be the right channel not really a question just wanted some advice lately

7:35 PM

The problem is that I start asking questions about tulpanancy as a whole lately if I'm just training myself to think a different way and believing it's someone else Fuck it, I spend months making Rosa(my tulpa) and now I'm starting to dissect her slowly cause there always that other dude in my head who goes like hey you sure that's an idea not of your own The more I look into it the more things start breaking down...it's just sad I'm unsure of what to do it just feels unsetteling lately so I wanted to make a new tulpa with whome I can practice switching to find a better solution, Rosa rejects the idea of switching so I need to make someone new who can teach me more about it. There's this idea that maybe I didn't truly make my tulpa even after it being months now...maybe there was something amiss from some point cause if I probably did then I shouldn't really stuggle again with this yet I do. When I was making tulpa I real did readings on many articles on DID and it just kinda kept me going and the community supporting me to go forward with it but now time has passed and that ambiguity returned for some reason lately even more, I'm unsure now (edited)

Ultimately, to answer your question, I believe yes, tulpamancy is the practice of convincing yourself you are not all of the thoughts in your own mind. The first thing you have to do is overcome your parrotnoia. After that, other skills in tulpamancy are a matter of making new habits, adjusting your beliefs, or a combination of both. Without overcoming that first step though, odds are good switching won't help ease your doubt and it might feed into it too. I personally didn't find switching to help with our doubts. However, even when confronted with that, does Rosa want to be you? If she wants that, then you may be happier integrating or embracing being median. If she doesn't, then you will remain separated. The paradox of tulpamancy is what you or your system wants tends to become what is real. If you want a tulpa and you work for one, you will get one. If you have a certain idea about how switching works, usually that is the outcome of your experience. While there are obvious limitations to this, in general believing something is a certain way leads to it being true. (edited)

8:00 PM

=== I don't like the idea of creating a tulpa to switch in general, and I think creating a tulpa with the intention to switch with them is unfair to them. I think you're better off building masks you still consider yourself if you want to play without having to burden another person. (edited)

Hmm...an interesting thought (edited)

8:07 PM

I think I had already progressed over parroting a while ago , things were working fine for us for a few months now until I started with self questioning again

8:09 PM

I feel I'm going back to square one

A long kiss goodnight

=== I don't like the idea of creating a tulpa to switch in general, and I think creating a tulpa with the intention to switch with them is unfair to them. I think you're better off building masks you still consider yourself if you want to play without having to burden another person. (edited)

I won't argue with that either but yknow human nature

8:11 PM

I don't really know what direction to take anymore things seems vague, I never get clear answers it jsut that endless cycle of self questioning asking opinions and and understanding yet nothing

I don't know if systems necessarily regress to parrotnoia. I think it's more like phase 1 parrotnoia phase 2 how separate of a person am I really? I wonder if some systems embracing becoming median is their way of resolving phase two. Our doubt was if this is real and would science think this is real, and we decided tulpas being deemed fake by science didn't matter to us. I don't have to stop being myself just because I'm told I'm not real, my belief in how real I am doesn't matter to me. (edited)

nibor

I don't really know what direction to take anymore things seems vague, I never get clear answers it jsut that endless cycle of self questioning asking opinions and and understanding yet nothing

I think you're looking at this back to front from how you would with your own identity. It sounds like you're looking for reasons but looking in the wrong place. You're simply not going to justify anything with science and understanding here, because frankly we don't seem to exist ourselves in our own brains, let alone tulpas. We're just states of emotion and associations. It's not understanding that gives you meaning. It's strong emotion. If you're questioning the veracity of your bond with a tulpa, I would encourage you to question why that is. Is it because you don't emotionally resonate with the companionship of your tulpa anymore as a person? Is it because you've stifled the output of the emotions you're trying to reach by simulating them and believing it? Why are you not feeling strong emotions? The answer to those questions can radically change what your response might be. And I don't think anyone can answer them for you. They're about what you want and need and whether or not you can actually get them from tulpamancy, rather than anything to do with the practice that we can blanket-apply to you.

You can break your tulpa down into parts, cut them off while their talking, look at what they said and think about how it was something you would have said or maybe accidentally parroted, block them out, etc and then you can say "Do I even have a tulpa? this doesn't work."

Tulpas (and hosts) exist on a moment to moment basis, based on what brain processes are running. So you can turn them off and also leave them turned off, and it won't be a very compelling experience. So instead of doing that, engage with them, keep them thinking, keep them processing. If they're only having simple, bland thoughts, engage more with them. You can have a complex, lively conversation with them one day, and nothing the next, that's the nature of impermanence. What kind of experience do you want?

A long kiss goodnight

I don't know if systems necessarily regress to parrotnoia. I think it's more like phase 1 parrotnoia phase 2 how separate of a person am I really? I wonder if some systems embracing becoming median is their way of resolving phase two. Our doubt was if this is real and would science think this is real, and we decided tulpas being deemed fake by science didn't matter to us. I don't have to stop being myself just because I'm told I'm not real, my belief in how real I am doesn't matter to me. (edited)

I'm sorry but could you inform me on what median is? You mentioned it earlier also

A median system is a system where the headmates see themselves as separate but consider themselves parts or facets of the same identity. For example, you could create a tulpa and later that tulpa decides they're a slightly different version of you. How separate the headmates can be from their host vary from system to system. I think two common approaches to a median system are one entity with multiple masks and group of headmates who all claim to be the same person.

A long kiss goodnight

A median system is a system where the headmates see themselves as separate but consider themselves parts or facets of the same identity. For example, you could create a tulpa and later that tulpa decides they're a slightly different version of you. How separate the headmates can be from their host vary from system to system. I think two common approaches to a median system are one entity with multiple masks and group of headmates who all claim to be the same person.

Why would anyone do that? Is it easier or something (edited)

I think it boils down to being median is more consistent with their views on tulpamancy. There are perks to being median including not having to worry about certain ethical issues as much

3:26 AM

Actually, there is another reason I just thought of- having a median sub-system can be helpful for warming up to merging and/or integration. Evergreen and Fish played around with that for a little bit with the goal of integrating and it seemed to work out for him

Hmm....I see I see I shall keep what you said in mind

Zen

I think you're looking at this back to front from how you would with your own identity. It sounds like you're looking for reasons but looking in the wrong place. You're simply not going to justify anything with science and understanding here, because frankly we don't seem to exist ourselves in our own brains, let alone tulpas. We're just states of emotion and associations. It's not understanding that gives you meaning. It's strong emotion. If you're questioning the veracity of your bond with a tulpa, I would encourage you to question why that is. Is it because you don't emotionally resonate with the companionship of your tulpa anymore as a person? Is it because you've stifled the output of the emotions you're trying to reach by simulating them and believing it? Why are you not feeling strong emotions? The answer to those questions can radically change what your response might be. And I don't think anyone can answer them for you. They're about what you want and need and whether or not you can actually get them from tulpamancy, rather than anything to do with the practice that we can blanket-apply to you.

I would agree with you on how you think we recognise ourselves for me I think it's not just general lack of emotional attachment with not just my Tulpa but with other people around me also. I was mostly looking towards someone to help me out and to gain another perspective over things but whenever I got a response it never seemed truly me or truly not me, believing it was not me seemed I was yet decieving myself, for every situation there are supposed 3 answers the thing is I never really support any particular answer fully it's like 70, 15,15 so I never really had any instance of getting a response which was truly different from my own thoughts, I mean I had already been doing this anyways before tulpanancy having another dude just point out the benifits of taking different answers and different directions. Things worked out fine but there is an uncanny sense of deceit somewhere a sense of nothing truly different but me and a lack of attachment which is developing overtime. (edited)

Yuka

Tulpas (and hosts) exist on a moment to moment basis, based on what brain processes are running. So you can turn them off and also leave them turned off, and it won't be a very compelling experience. So instead of doing that, engage with them, keep them thinking, keep them processing. If they're only having simple, bland thoughts, engage more with them. You can have a complex, lively conversation with them one day, and nothing the next, that's the nature of impermanence. What kind of experience do you want?

Hmm..I see How complex do you reckon the conversation must be to decide when it isn't me, personally I've been having conversations with myself before I got into tulpamancy different thoughts different lenses so where do I draw a line should I just accept it?

5:41 AM

== Other problem that I have been very deeply observing of late I think is that I never truly display a single kind of personality, I think no one does but lately this feeling is intensifying as I observe my behavior changes from person to person and is never really stable, how do I put it but it's kinda I tend to Change the way I behave completepy when interacting with different people not just like small changes around someone but like my entire taste in things change and how I perceive things also changes the way I speak changes and it just feels disconnecting to who I see myself as (edited)

nibor

== Other problem that I have been very deeply observing of late I think is that I never truly display a single kind of personality, I think no one does but lately this feeling is intensifying as I observe my behavior changes from person to person and is never really stable, how do I put it but it's kinda I tend to Change the way I behave completepy when interacting with different people not just like small changes around someone but like my entire taste in things change and how I perceive things also changes the way I speak changes and it just feels disconnecting to who I see myself as (edited)

This is normal

7:43 AM

It’s not a “problem”

7:45 AM

However high levels of it might mean you have a weak sense of self. If you will create a tulpa with stronger sense of self than you, they might become the host. You might want to focus on “personality forcing” yourself first ;P

hmm...dont really mind a tulpa becoming a host

proxi

This is normal

well great! I guess Ill go ahead then

proxi

However high levels of it might mean you have a weak sense of self. If you will create a tulpa with stronger sense of self than you, they might become the host. You might want to focus on “personality forcing” yourself first ;P

Personality isn't static, we act different ways around different people and different situations; over time, as we learn, our responses change and slowly our personality shifts to correspond to that change. I wouldn't call that a weak sense of self.

Its fun in a way, behaving in different fashions around different people watching them form different images of you and just some slight alterations will change that image

8:05 AM

I try to ask people what kind of person they though I was and use the results for the next time I talk to someone

Deleted User

Personality isn't static, we act different ways around different people and different situations; over time, as we learn, our responses change and slowly our personality shifts to correspond to that change. I wouldn't call that a weak sense of self.

I mentioned high levels of that experience can indicate weak sense of self, not that it does in this case

8:14 AM

First thing I said was literally “this is normal” lol

nibor

hmm...dont really mind a tulpa becoming a host

Your tulpa is likely to experience body disphoria especially if they are going to have a different gender than the body, be careful with it because one unhappy person might be replaced by another unhappy person

nibor

Its fun in a way, behaving in different fashions around different people watching them form different images of you and just some slight alterations will change that image

You are who you present yourself as, indeed. Most people are incapable of this, because they emotionally react to everything and cannot conceal that reaction; by creating space between reaction and response you may present yourself in whatever way you wish. I don't think this is healthy, however, as you're bound to end up in a throwaway identity hell where no connections are meaningful anymore. As fun as it is; stick to one, controlled image. (edited)

Deleted User

You are who you present yourself as, indeed. Most people are incapable of this, because they emotionally react to everything and cannot conceal that reaction; by creating space between reaction and response you may present yourself in whatever way you wish. I don't think this is healthy, however, as you're bound to end up in a throwaway identity hell where no connections are meaningful anymore. As fun as it is; stick to one, controlled image. (edited)

mmm...yea, I also think I have had a general lack of emotional attachment for a while now with nearly everyone, including my tulpa which led to this entire conversation, its disheartening indeed but it is what enabled me to engage in very different behaviours which I used to think weren't native to me, lacking that attachment as you said makes it way more easy to wiggle around with your personality (edited)

nibor

mmm...yea, I also think I have had a general lack of emotional attachment for a while now with nearly everyone, including my tulpa which led to this entire conversation, its disheartening indeed but it is what enabled me to engage in very different behaviours which I used to think weren't native to me, lacking that attachment as you said makes it way more easy to wiggle around with your personality (edited)

Consider it a gift. Read up on Machiavellianism if you want to use it to your own advantage; understand that it's very difficult for most people to reconcile conflicting behaviour, be conscious not to alienate others; ingenuousness, perceived hostility and envy need to be managed else they will spiral out of control. Best of luck.

Deleted User

Consider it a gift. Read up on Machiavellianism if you want to use it to your own advantage; understand that it's very difficult for most people to reconcile conflicting behaviour, be conscious not to alienate others; ingenuousness, perceived hostility and envy need to be managed else they will spiral out of control. Best of luck.

I thought machiavellianism is some sort of ideology turns out its part of antisocial personality group.....

It's also a political theory.

So will i neve be able to form a good relation with my tulpa....

9:42 AM

hmmm....is that you alexandra!

1

9:42 AM

when did you become a detective

9:42 AM

oh no, wrong channel

nibor

I thought machiavellianism is some sort of ideology turns out its part of antisocial personality group.....

They're just jealous. kappa

Deleted User

They're just jealous. kappa

arent we all?

nibor

mmm...yea, I also think I have had a general lack of emotional attachment for a while now with nearly everyone, including my tulpa which led to this entire conversation, its disheartening indeed but it is what enabled me to engage in very different behaviours which I used to think weren't native to me, lacking that attachment as you said makes it way more easy to wiggle around with your personality (edited)

I may have said it before but I don't believe you can meaningfully change your desires with reason. When I think of how I failed to 'mancy initially and then came back, long before I succeeded I knew everything I know now, really. But I hadn't been able to live that mindset so it was just alien to me. If there's a new perspective for you to achieve that allows you to happily reconcile your feelings it has to be gained through experience and emotion. No amount of scrutiny will help, at least from my experience.

12:19 PM

Ultimately I can't even set you on a particular path, since if I do, you'll be going into the same path with foreknowledge of what you're doing, and the only reason my own brain relaxed and achieved a different perspective is because I explicitly did not know what I was doing was tulpamancy. I had sworn it off and set it aside.

I was mostly looking towards someone to help me out and to gain another perspective over things

A tulpa is capable of having a slightly different perspective, but in general a tulpa's perspective is going to be similar to their host's. At the end of the day, a tulpa and host draw from the same pool of memories and have access to each other's arguments. We talk about each other's tulpamancy as well as our own and on the outside it can look like the same philosophy on tulpamancy (if you ask Gray about switching, he'll give you a slightly different version of what I would give) I think the times where we disagreed the most is when it was about a friendship or judging how important something is to us. For example, on believing in God: Gray is agnostic who talks like an atheist, Chrome is uncertain, most of my headmates haven't thought about it where I thought about it a little but honestly I don't really care. However, it's worth noting we tend to gravitate towards a Christian interpretation of God because that's what we were exposed too. Keep in mind deep motivations to do something can lead to seeking out new experiences (I lead to us picking up Discord, social behaviors we lacked, etc.)

Zen

Ultimately I can't even set you on a particular path, since if I do, you'll be going into the same path with foreknowledge of what you're doing, and the only reason my own brain relaxed and achieved a different perspective is because I explicitly did not know what I was doing was tulpamancy. I had sworn it off and set it aside.

is its a dilemma? I have to not know something to do else Id question it to an extent that Ill not be able to do it?

A long kiss goodnight

I was mostly looking towards someone to help me out and to gain another perspective over things

A tulpa is capable of having a slightly different perspective, but in general a tulpa's perspective is going to be similar to their host's. At the end of the day, a tulpa and host draw from the same pool of memories and have access to each other's arguments. We talk about each other's tulpamancy as well as our own and on the outside it can look like the same philosophy on tulpamancy (if you ask Gray about switching, he'll give you a slightly different version of what I would give) I think the times where we disagreed the most is when it was about a friendship or judging how important something is to us. For example, on believing in God: Gray is agnostic who talks like an atheist, Chrome is uncertain, most of my headmates haven't thought about it where I thought about it a little but honestly I don't really care. However, it's worth noting we tend to gravitate towards a Christian interpretation of God because that's what we were exposed too. Keep in mind deep motivations to do something can lead to seeking out new experiences (I lead to us picking up Discord, social behaviors we lacked, etc.)

hmm....that just destroys my reasons for having tulpas...Im not sure whats the point of having one then? Companionship? I already have that voice in my head and I can hold conversations with it if need be then why is there such a long process to make one?

If you don't want a tulpa anymore, you don't have to make one. Not all tulpas take long to make, and not all thoughtforms necessarily go out of their way to be separate individuals. Our Sub. Rep. likes to challenge his sense of identity and try to bend it

nibor

hmm....that just destroys my reasons for having tulpas...Im not sure whats the point of having one then? Companionship? I already have that voice in my head and I can hold conversations with it if need be then why is there such a long process to make one?

That's a strange statement. What's the point in having any relationship with anyone? What's the point in anything? The only reason people do anything is because they want to do it, not because there's some sort of abstract truth behind their actions. My reason is companionship at this point. More specifically I'm experiencing love, depth, and intimacy from it. Initially I think I was simply trying to prove something to myself, but that mindset just went nowhere.

I'm here because I want too, same thing goes for my headmates

Zen

That's a strange statement. What's the point in having any relationship with anyone? What's the point in anything? The only reason people do anything is because they want to do it, not because there's some sort of abstract truth behind their actions. My reason is companionship at this point. More specifically I'm experiencing love, depth, and intimacy from it. Initially I think I was simply trying to prove something to myself, but that mindset just went nowhere.

hows it strange? My reasons for tulpamancy were many but the major ones were to explore into the idea of having a companion, to have another perspective over things and the want to learn more than I see. Over the course of past several months I have tried learning alot about the ideas and Ive had people encourage me. Ranger remarked that a tulpa whatsoever will have perspective that is similar to the host, I wont believe in ranger fully but it kinda shudders the foundation on which I decided to learn tulpamancy

You don't seem to be cognizant of the fact that those aren't your real reasons. You're talking about meaningless abstractions. Your real reasons are measured in desire and feeling, not ideas. When you remove an animals capacity to make emotional decisions, rather than make decisions at all, it simply dies of its own volition. But to offer a counterpoint to Ranger, I would say Rhys is quite different from me in the extreme. However, clearly, anything I know to be fact is rather unshakeable internally - The usefulness of another perspective is purely in being able to express different emotional states readily, both internally and externally. It's not a complete other perspective in that you can't really hold different information, just different outlooks.

Zen

You don't seem to be cognizant of the fact that those aren't your real reasons. You're talking about meaningless abstractions. Your real reasons are measured in desire and feeling, not ideas. When you remove an animals capacity to make emotional decisions, rather than make decisions at all, it simply dies of its own volition. But to offer a counterpoint to Ranger, I would say Rhys is quite different from me in the extreme. However, clearly, anything I know to be fact is rather unshakeable internally - The usefulness of another perspective is purely in being able to express different emotional states readily, both internally and externally. It's not a complete other perspective in that you can't really hold different information, just different outlooks.

Isnt what I stated desires? A want to explore more into the idea of having a companion, a desire to see things for a different outlook(yes thats a better word) and a want to learn more? meaningless abstractions seems like a vague word Hmm...I see about your tulpa yes I would agree that was something I was hoping to achieve perspective not possible but yes outlook is the better term, I see, I shall keep that in mind (edited)

nibor

Isnt what I stated desires? A want to explore more into the idea of having a companion, a desire to see things for a different outlook(yes thats a better word) and a want to learn more? meaningless abstractions seems like a vague word Hmm...I see about your tulpa yes I would agree that was something I was hoping to achieve perspective not possible but yes outlook is the better term, I see, I shall keep that in mind (edited)

Abstractions aren't truly desires. They're justifications for them. At our core we perform behaviour, we experience output from emotion, and then we chase after those emotions in a feedback loop trying to improve our output. Rationalization happens after that. Not before. Rationalization is just a higher level tool for improving the output of that feedback loop with planning - And it's also often wrong. Beneath abstraction you are feeling emotions, and those emotions are giving you negative output. Simply put, you are experiencing cognitive dissonance - You don't want to do tulpamancy because your brain is telling you that you don't. The question should be how you change your emotional outlook - Not the upper level abstraction of it, because abstractions are just for planning, they don't override emotion. Can you picture the state you actually want to achieve? That is what you need to do. To know what resonates.

Hmm..I see How complex do you reckon the conversation must be to decide when it isn't me, personally I've been having conversations with myself before I got into tulpamancy different thoughts different lenses so where do I draw a line should I just accept it?

@nibor - jump No, that's not what I meant. If it's your tulpa talking, just accept it, whether what they're saying is simple or complex

3:05 PM

As for tulpas having a different outlook or having different opinions, that depends on the tulpa. If you leave their personality up to whatever they happen to form, then yeah, they may not end up very different. What would be driving them to be different, with the same hardware as the host? Some tulpas want to be more different so they go out of their way do things different from their host and double down on any differences

Also yes, that. I would reiterate that Rhys was a literary thoughtform for months of writing-time. He essentially underwent a very, very intensive form of personality forcing complete with rigorous testing of those ideas.

3:07 PM

He was also made as a foil to my own personality rather intentionally.

What make a tulpa different, is having a different thought pattern... personality, self-schemas, stuff like that. If they don't spontaneously have those differences, you can build them up

3:09 PM

Yeah, I think Zen's example is good. Writers can make developed characters who are very different from them--if that character becomes a tulpa, then they'll have a very different personality etc

Even though I typically have a different mindset than my headmates, over time my perspective became more similar, not less (for the better too). Personality forcing only takes you so far, you would either need a detailed and updating backstory to affect your judgement or to get different experiences from your host.

Zen

Abstractions aren't truly desires. They're justifications for them. At our core we perform behaviour, we experience output from emotion, and then we chase after those emotions in a feedback loop trying to improve our output. Rationalization happens after that. Not before. Rationalization is just a higher level tool for improving the output of that feedback loop with planning - And it's also often wrong. Beneath abstraction you are feeling emotions, and those emotions are giving you negative output. Simply put, you are experiencing cognitive dissonance - You don't want to do tulpamancy because your brain is telling you that you don't. The question should be how you change your emotional outlook - Not the upper level abstraction of it, because abstractions are just for planning, they don't override emotion. Can you picture the state you actually want to achieve? That is what you need to do. To know what resonates.

I would agree with that, I won't lie but I'm giving myself reason yet to do things I wish to do, I wish to believe yet it just seems so contradictory my myself that I am unable to do so, it is disheartening but I still strive to do so. Beneath I am unaware of the emotions I feel, how do I change my outlook I do not know that since I'm simply unaware of my own emotions, truth be told I am unaware of my own reasons for existence, I feel no need to but I'm compelled to because of the responsibilies I have to carry. Can I picture I perfect state, yes indeed how do I attain it, I do not know

Yuka

Hmm..I see How complex do you reckon the conversation must be to decide when it isn't me, personally I've been having conversations with myself before I got into tulpamancy different thoughts different lenses so where do I draw a line should I just accept it?

@nibor - jump No, that's not what I meant. If it's your tulpa talking, just accept it, whether what they're saying is simple or complex

oh I see I see, get ya

Yuka

As for tulpas having a different outlook or having different opinions, that depends on the tulpa. If you leave their personality up to whatever they happen to form, then yeah, they may not end up very different. What would be driving them to be different, with the same hardware as the host? Some tulpas want to be more different so they go out of their way do things different from their host and double down on any differences

Yea I would have to agree with that, however if thats the case then Id strive to have a tulpa who does things differently, it might just be a pain more be but I reckon Id learn more and loose less from that

Zen

Also yes, that. I would reiterate that Rhys was a literary thoughtform for months of writing-time. He essentially underwent a very, very intensive form of personality forcing complete with rigorous testing of those ideas.

oh a writer, yea well I see how the personality was delibrately forced in a particular way

If you are not yet sure how you respond to things at a deeper level, I would strongly suggest doing some general mindfulness stuff. Live, and recognize your emotions as they come; trace their sources, and judge whether they are what you want to be feeling, and how to feel something else. Emotion is built up over time, and to some degree you can't fight what is super-ingrained, but it's still learned behaviour and you can alter the inputs. Older things take more time to undo, is all.

oof that seems really boring to do